"Hallelujah Night"...? Really...?

[MauEvig]

I think this might be a ploy from people to actually try and destroy traditional Halloween instead of letting it "evolve" as I would expect it to. Personally I would rather have Trunk or Treat or the Business wide trick or treat than this. At least it would still be Halloween, but this is ridiculous!
Now I have heard of churches giving out candy, that's fine but "Hallelujah night" is basically made as a "replacement" for Halloween completely destroying the traditional darker overtones of it with a more religious context. Sure it's fun for the kids, but this is on the borderline of brainwashing in my opinion.
There's absolutely no reason Christians can't enjoy or celebrate Halloween just the way it is, plenty of people on here are Christian who also love Halloween and I completely respect that. It's when religion goes as far as to try and destroy one of my favorite holidays that angers me to no end.
The worst part is, how do you compete with this sort of thing? I always thought trick or treat was healthy for the neighborhood, it helps you to put on your own show so to speak, and get to know your neighbors and their kids. When I lived in New York people got a kick out of my costumes and antics and my singing black cat. But it seems here in the south churches have taken over by giving the kids really big chocolate bars, which most of us can't afford but thanks to funding by the churches they can afford this stuff.
A lady I talked to when I was still working at the grocery store said she rather "focus on Jesus" instead of celebrate Halloween. Really? Why can't you do both? It's one thing to go to Sunday School, have Wednesday night Bible study, and even have your Youth Groups and Bible camps. I'm perfectly fine with that. But try to replace and eradicate Halloween, and I'm putting my foot down. Can't we just put aside our religious differences for one night and enjoy it? Halloween doesn't have to be all about blood and gore, I celebrate the fun parts of it. Yes there are bad people out there who give it a bad image, and I disagree with people who harm innocent animals, or try to harm children.
People will try and argue that Halloween has pagan traditions in it. But Christmas and Easter do too, and they don't harm anyone. (Unless you count the crazy Black Friday shoppers, which if you ask me, I'd rather have the less violent Halloween than people going crazy over buying stuff that we don't really need...all because they are so afraid of getting something they don't like. Why not just be greatful for what you get? It's better to give than to receive anyway, have people forgot this? And what about the dinner and getting together with loved ones? That's more important to me on Christmas anyway)
Sorry for the rant you guys but this really bothers me. I respect people's beliefs, and I respect Christians for having these beliefs, but this just goes too far just like the "Hell houses" do which I believe were discussed on here before to use scare tactics to convert people.
I will also add one more thing: It's actually healthy to approach the subject of death once in a while. We can't ignore it because it's part of life. By having Halloween and embracing it, we embrace a part of ourselves, it gives us a chance to poke fun at death. Real life isn't all sun shine and rainbows, we can't just pretend it is. We can make the most of it and embrace and appreciate life, but we also have to respect that death is part of it. Just as we have the light of day, so also we must have the darkness of night. If there is in fact a God, (I don't believe in the Christian God, but if this God does exist and I'm completely wrong) obviously he had the wisdom to know this, which is why he created day and night, why there is balance. This was something someone brought up on here before: It's healthy to poke fun of death! Without Halloween, we wouldn't have that sort of outlit.

[Fall fanatic]

I agree.
I am a Christian myself, and try to be devout. In fact, one of my nerdy hobbies is studying theology and Christian origins. And there is nothing wrong with Halloween. It is great fun. I could see a conflict if people were joining the occult or stuff like that, but Halloween (at least the way I see it) is having fun with all of that stuff. We all have different beliefs, but I find it kind of silly that other Christians have an issue with Halloween. For if they believe Christ won victory over death, then why not laugh at death? Instead of treating it seriously, we have fun with the idea of ghosts and witchcraft. It's just good fun.

Have a great Halloween, everyone.

[Andybev01]

I agree.
I am a Christian myself, and try to be devout. In fact, one of my nerdy hobbies is studying theology and Christian origins. And there is nothing wrong with Halloween. It is great fun. I could see a conflict if people were joining the occult or stuff like that, but Halloween (at least the way I see it) is having fun with all of that stuff. We all have different beliefs, but I find it kind of silly that other Christians have an issue with Halloween. For if they believe Christ won victory over death, then why not laugh at death? Instead of treating it seriously, we have fun with the idea of ghosts and witchcraft. It's just good fun.

Have a great Halloween, everyone.

Nicely put.

[Murfreesboro]

Oh, I completely agree. Around here, most of the churches, including our own, have "fall festivals," but these are not usually held on Halloween night, so as far as I'm concerned, I feel those festivals just add to the fun of the season.

There was one year when I did attend a "Hell house" (not sure if that's what it was called, but that was the idea). I don't begrudge those events to the churches and I would expect that they would justify them with some evangelistic outreach, but I would rather go to a commercial haunted house, honestly.

I have had some friends who were very anxious about Halloween, unnecessarily so, IMO. They wouldn't let their kids carve a pumpkin or participate in TOT, wouldn't even let them read the Harry Potter books because they contained magic and witchcraft. (When my older son was in grade school, he asked me about that. I told him that Harry Potter lives in the first place because his dying mother casts a love spell on him. I said that the theme of love conquering death was the quintessential Christian theme, so I saw nothing at all wrong with the values of the Harry Potter world.)

It irks me when some people or religious groups try to discourage the celebration of Halloween, but I have sort of a "live and let live" attitude about it. As long as I can still have my yard haunt, or go on a ghost tour, or attend a seasonal haunted attraction, I'm going to keep my Halloween in my own fashion and let them not keep it in theirs.

[NeverMore]

I'm sure you realize this is the same thing 'The Church' did to co-opt Samhain. Sort of backfired because Halloween grew out of their shenanigans.

[Demonic Duck]

Mau don't apologize for your rant. It wasn't the first of its kind around here and I'm sure it won't be the last. Some people will do things people will do things to use Jackson
Halloween for their own agenda but just keep it in your way and that's what's important. Personally I think they anti-Halloween folks are trying to up their game because if anything Halloween is becoming a bigger and bigger holiday. More people are spending more money at the more Halloween shops that open not to mention the Halloween section in almost any store you go in. So don't get discouraged there will always be Halloween nuts kind us to keep it going!

[Murfreesboro]

I refuse to attend any church event on Halloween night itself, including our own. There was one year when our church held Trunk-or-Treat on Halloween night, and I would have none of it, because I did see that as attempting to co-opt Halloween. I have zero problem participating in it when it is held near, but not on, the night, as it has been the last few years.

We have raised our kids in my husband's Lutheran church, and for them, Halloween is "Reformation Day," the anniversary of the day in 1517 when Martin Luther posted the 95 Theses on the door of the cathedral in Wittenberg. I understand that they want to commemorate the beginning of their denomination, and of the entire Protestant Reformation, by marking this day somehow. Some of the older Lutherans can be a bit crotchety about it, but most of them are OK with sharing the night. This year they observed Reformation Day on Sunday.

When my kids were little, we sometimes experienced proselytizing in one form or another in our neighborhood. I recall one year when a nice lady dressed as a friendly clown and passed out candy along with religious tracts. Since we were Christian, I didn't mind, but it amused me that she had felt it necessary to do that. More than once, a different family, ardent Democrats, had passed out campaign literature for their preferred candidates along with the candy. Because we are Republican, my husband was livid when the kids got home. I said, "Oh, well, if you go begging at other people's houses, I guess you can't complain about what they choose to give you." Our kids were too young to notice, and the campaign literature ended up in the trash can. It certainly had no influence on our voting. I would imagine the same thing happens with religious tracts. People who do that are well-intentioned, I'm sure, but they won't win any converts that way.

[NeverMore]

Party poopers everywhere...

• http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nati ... /18059579/

[TheHallow31]

It's just another ploy by brainwashed ignorant religious fanatics. It isn't the first time and it certainly won't be the last, but it will fail nonetheless. They always do. Halloween will carry on unaffected like it always has.

[TheHallow31]

It's just another ploy by brainwashed ignorant religious fanatics. It isn't the first time and it certainly won't be the last, but it will fail nonetheless. They always do. Halloween will carry on unaffected like it always has.

[Murfreesboro]

Party poopers everywhere...

• http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nati ... /18059579/

That may have had more to do with the noise and traffic created by fans of the display than with religious zealots.

There is someone in our vicinity who has won the Christmas lights contest, and whose display has caused traffic issues a few streets over from us, enough so that police had to come and help direct traffic there. I noticed that last year, that house was dark. I think sometimes neighbors do get tired of all the commotion. (His light show was cued to music, but you had to tune to a certain radio station to hear it, so noise wasn't the issue. I gather that, in the case cited above, Michael Jackson's Thriller was blaring out over the neighborhood. I enjoy that song, but I can see how that could get old if you lived next door.)

When I was writing above about people passing out religious and political tracts on Halloween, I forgot to mention that there is a Baptist church in our neighborhood. Once, several years back, they did pass out fliers about Halloween being a pagan celebration and the devil's holiday. At least, I think those fliers came from them. I chuckled and tossed mine. Meanwhile, one nearby street is a huge destination street on Halloween night, a big Halloween block party. So if that church meant to try to stop it, they did not succeed.

[MauEvig]

It seems to be working in my area though, because from what I heard, Halloween isn't as big of a deal as it used to be. Of course I haven't been here long enough to really get the difference, and it may just depend on which town and area one lives in. The town my college is in by contrast, has Halloween decorations throughout the city with some dummies made up of Halloween costumes and such. This particular town is kind of old-timey anyway, and I love it! I think the dressed up dummies is creative, while turning a cheap costume into a prop. They had Trick or Treating for the college students (which was fun, I may post more about that in another thread) and while I've seen a few houses decked out for Halloween, it doesn't seem to be a huge deal. Although, the road I drive to college has some cool things going on, they hung ghosts in trees so as you drive along all of a sudden you get "snuck up on" by flying ghosts, a demented rabbit, a witch and a creepy looking guy looking to "hitch hike". I get excited when I see that stuff out. There's also a yard full of blow up decorations, I have some but I haven't got any out this year. I plan to get them out next year though.
I thought it was kind of lame that parents were taking their kids to churches for their Halloween celebrations, but it still boggles my mind how exactly they can go about handing out the big candy bars when normal people usually hand out the candy that comes in bags at Wal*mart somewhere between $2.50 and $5.00 a bag depending on what size you get. (Even then, I've seen some bags about $8.00 to $12.00 and buying all those big candy bars can be pretty expensive). The trouble is, it makes it really hard to compete when churches are doing things like this. I read online that some churches even had something along the lines of carnival rides, petting zoos and things along those lines...I don't think the churches around here are that outlandish but still...how does the average American compete, especially in today's economy?

Still, at least I know I'll have two trick or treaters this year and I made some cute little treat bags shaped like spiders for them.

I have to agree with the hallow though, it really is an "ignorant ploy" by religious fanatics. What I don't understand is why don't they do this stuff on a different day aside from Halloween? Of course, even if they did that a lot of parents would probably still not participate in Halloween. -_- *sigh*

Murf sounds like you did the right thing. Those religious pamphlets and attempts to win over votes for potential politicians belong right in "file 13." I don't think I'd ever want to go to one of those "hell houses" though. I've been to enough Church "events" whose goal is to scare people into accepting their dogma. I've been to two presentations, which were play performances, "Heaven's gates and hell's flames" I believe was one, "Glory and the Fire" I think was another one. They were pretty much the same, showing different scenarios where if they accepted Jesus they went to heaven, if they didn't they went to hell. (At least the devil was entertaining lol) But I just can't stand these scare tactics, I've had enough of it when I was a kid. I'd rather watch a good horror movie any day or go to a real Haunted house. I realize things like drunk driving, drug overdoses etc. and such are things that need to be talked about, but not in your face and such. Sadly, it kind of makes me glad I'm not a Christian anymore because I can see past all of it and just be annoyed with it instead of scared about it.

Well like demonic duck said, I'll still keep my Halloween and let them keep their non-Halloween, but if it comes down to people pressuring others not to celebrate it, or tell me to take my decorations down, I'll tell them they'd better get off my lawn.

I definitely agree with most of you on here, I'm just concerned that Halloween is just a blip for a lot of people around here, and I'd just like people to see that Halloween fun can be harmless and not everything has to be about demons, satanic rituals, violence and harming animals and children. All of us here on the forum I know, like to have good harmless fun here, and like they said on the Nightmare Night episode of My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic (Titled: Luna Eclipsed from season 2), it's "fun" to get scared sometimes. I really think people should watch that episode to see the positive side of Halloween (even though they call it Nightmare Night, it's still the same premises) and I plan to uphold my fun Halloween celebrations. I want to set my own standard, and let people know that trick or treating can be safe. I see myself as a good person, and I won't let bad people ruin my fun. (Or paranoid overly religious people). Halloween is what you make it, and it's open to people regardless of their religious affiliation in my book. Personally I don't think the pagan origin matters as much as what people do with it now. (although it is always good to know history, and interesting too. ^^)

The downside with "Hallelujah" night: Not a good option for us secularists who may not believe the same way. I'm all for respecting religious beliefs, as long as they aren't pushed on other people.

On a side note, I can see why having noise in all those decorations can be distracting, even though I do enjoy some of those lit up houses that have the Christmas music on it on Youtube, but there probably should be a limit. I think just having the lights and props are enough without adding music, except maybe on the actual night of the event. Like, for Halloween I think it would be cool to have spooky music, or have Christmas music on Christmas Eve and Christmas day, but not all month long.

[Murfreesboro]

My husband and I decided to add sound effects to our yard haunt this year, but we will definitely be playing them only during TOT, and probably not too loudly then. We display our lights as soon as we have them up, which was mid-month this year. I find that it attracts more TOTers if you light up ahead of the big night. People are scouting out the houses for a week or two ahead.

Mau, it sounds like you have settled in a little enclave that is not into Halloween, whereas many of those in neighboring towns do celebrate it. Sometimes, if one person starts a good yard haunt, others will follow, and you can really get something going over a few years.

There is a huge non-denominational church here in town that has a big fall festival every October, with the bouncy houses and the petting zoos and all that stuff. When they first started, they did do it on Halloween night, but they had it last Sunday this year. I dislike seeing that stuff set up as a competition to Halloween, but when it is done on another day, I think it just gives people something more to celebrate.

I wouldn't worry too much about the lure of the big candy bars, since I don't think collecting the candy is really the heart of Halloween's appeal. It (candy collection) is more of an excuse to masquerade outdoors and get a pleasant shiver as we mock the scary side of life. I always just make sure that I give out candy I myself like to eat.

About the Hell houses--I don't know if those are as popular as they were a few years ago. I don't really think they ever accomplished much. People who attend them are looking for a Halloween scare; I don't think they want to be preached to. And in my one experience at such a place, I found it too "pat," if that makes any sense. Evil is more nuanced than you can convey through a Hell house.

[MauEvig]

Yeah...I think you might be right Murf. Now the lady who lived here prior to us was pretty big into Halloween and Christmas...and she had quite the display. Mine's really small in comparison since I don't have all the big blow ups out and stuff, but I think if I maintain a cheerful attitude toward the holiday, maybe people will see it's "not so bad after all" and follow suit.

If all else fails, i could always go to where the celebrations are taking place, but I do want to be home so I can hand out candy to the little boys next door in a sort of "mini trick or treat" if you will. For me, I just have fun handing out the candy and seeing all the costumes. When I still lived in New York sometimes I'd just go out for a stroll and see all the decorations just to walk out there at night and get the feel for it. Like you said, I like the "pleasant shiver" of mocking the scarier side of things. I think that is one reason why I enjoyed the ghost tour so much, and why it felt like trick or treating. In fact, I think that's exactly why it felt like trick or treating. Plus it was fun and educational, and I hope to do it again next year.

Halloween makes me want to be a kid again just so I can dress in a costume and walk around without people looking at me weird. Even though I don't trick or treat (with the exception of the College having Trick or Treat for students...that was really awesome!) I still like the feel of it and the spirit behind Halloween itself, and I still dress up. I don't care if I'm 80, I'm still going to dress up when I get to that age. Unless I have dementia or something. Maybe I should make a living will, will dress up until the day I die. And then I hope some kind soul will put a pumpkin or toy black cat on my grave every year at Halloween. OK that sounds morbid, haha but Halloween is about death after all.

[Murfreesboro]

I love ghost tours, have been on a couple of them here locally, but not thisyear.

Tonight we will have a yard haunt, but we have arranged fro my college-aged son to take it over for about a half hour so my husband and I can stroll the highly decorated street about a block and a half from here. He has never seen it, and he says he'd like to. I will costume, but my husband will not. My daughter is going to a party, so she is off-site this evening.

Alas, it is predicted to be very cold tonight (even maybe snow! In TN! In October!), and damp, so I'm not sure how big the TOTing is going to be tonight.